The last movie you saw...

[dinky]

30 years from now, we'll be lucky if there's a city on natural ground that's above water. if lead actors are gonna command 20 million dollars per movie, I'd expect that change to occur far sooner.

that said, I think it's a bit...as max would say...gay for the goal to be to replace real people. especially since we live in a star-driven, paparazzi culture. I know a lot of people are jacking-off to the pseudo-but-not-really-even-naked angelina jolie character, and apparently there's quite a culture built-up around grown men jacking off to anime characters, but those are really small minorities. people want real people to starfuck...or dream of starfucking.

[maxpayne2409]

i love the word starfuck, and yes i would indeed say it's gay

[Jynks]

I totally disagree.. people love characters not ACTORS. Actors are made famous BY the hit characters they play. No the other way around.

Take say Indiana Jones. No one could imaging that being played by anyone but Ford. So some may say that the star ford made the charicter of Indiana. I think it is the other way around.

If the Indiana movies were made as full animated features where the animation was so good you could not tell the difference (and that day is coming) then the charicter would be just as popular. imo. BUT we could have Indiana movies made for ever as the actor will nvr get old and crusty.. like Indiana 4 is coming out and ford is wat almost 70?

i was in the cinima a while back when shrek 3 was still playing and ratatouille was still coming.. and noticed that out of the 11 posters for coming features.. 9 where animated. So this is already happening. Once the tech get even better we will see more and more.

James Cameron's new battle angel alita film has a completely cg actor as the MAIN charicter, alita... yet another example. I just finished post production on the TinTin movie.. a 3d animated realistic rendered feature... your telling me if tin tin was made 10 years ago it would have been animated.. not a chance. Golem was 3D as was jar jar... all stepping stones to what Beowolf is ... a completely 3d animated realistic feature... no actors.. just voice actors... and it is flawed tech wise, for now.. BUT it is a glimpse of the future of film.

[dinky]

I see your point and don't necessarily disagree on principle. but I think you have to consider that we are already a starfucker, celebrity driven culture. so the fact that grendal's "naked" mother looks like angelina jolie is not a coincidence. if you were starting the very concept of movies/tv from scratch, then that's another issue. but since stars are already established, we look for them and will continue to expect them. :2cents:

personally, I hope you're right. I want you to be right and be right quickly. it's not that I particularly want all cgi movies. but the salaries we pay celebrities are a joke. and the less they like the movie, the more money they command for each "performance." it's like the system is designed, top down, to produce half-assed crap. and the threat of no-named leads voicing cgi characters would go a long way in reallocating production funds. that's the dream, anyway. the funny thing to me is that adaptations like Beowulf or LotR already have established, "famous" characters, so I think they are the stories that benefit the very least from established stars in the film.

[MyK]

I've started with UK stand-up comedy, well not quite, just familiarising myself with mainstream names of the *khmm* genre *khmm* for the moment. I'm currently watching first four series of "QI" that has some interesting comedians in it, tho they're not only British and the panel is more or less the same with 10 or so different names. Or at least so far as I only got to mid season 3 The "TV Heaven, Telly Hell" was also an interesting panel in that regard. I won't ask of you (at least not just yet) to give me that list we talked about Max, as I'd still like to see more of them in panels and alike. So, if it isn't too much of a bother, I'd rather like to ask for a list of some other panels with different Brit stand-up comedians in it? TIA

[maxpayne2409]

to be honest other then the ones i already mentioned

Have i got news for you
8 out of 10 cats
QI
mock the week
tv heaven, telly hell

i can't really think of anymore off hand

Never mind the buzzcocks is a similar styled music/comedy panel show, there's currently 21 series of that, with series 21 being the new series currently airing

[MyK]

I watch Never Mind The Buzzcocks on telly whenever I get a chance but sadly that's not that often. I have this strange biorhythm set for life on Mars (25h day) so sticking with scheduled programming is kinda difficult for me To all fairness I'm rather educated in Brit stand up comedy for a non-Brit so the list of performers I know of is quite long. I'm actually more interested in less commonly known performers and such panels are not very helpful with that at all if (and it seems that's mostly the case) there's Allan Davies in the guests list They could still be terribly funny, mind... I have a list of stand up comedians that I don't know anything of (or have simply forgotten about) but have heard/read of, that I'm interested in their work and it's prolly best if I give you the list:

Kristen Schall (this "chick" rings some bells tho I don't remember which ones)
Phil Kay (only seen him in panels)
Alex Horne
Jason Manford
John Richardson
Frankie Boyle (a frequent panels guest but have never seen him take the floor)
Milton Jones
Mark Watson
Russell Kane
Seymour Mace
Miles Jupp
Ian Stone (now where did I see him? Fingers on Buzz... cocks?)
Justin Moorhouse
Paul Sinha (gay Asian... should be a laugh)
Simon Amstell
Jo Caulfield (miss gag or the other way around???)
Paul Foot
Jim Jeffries (now why isn't he a panel regular I wonder?)
Stewart Lee
Adam Bloom
Andrew Lawrence

Might not all be Brits mind you

[maxpayne2409]

Frankie Boyle is one ff my favourite ever comedians, he takes the floor a lot at the edinburgh fringe festival and suchlike, but has only released 1 (hard to find) dvd

Stewart lee performs alongside richard herring a lot on tv in shows like fist of fun and this morning with richard not judy, he also appears on his own in armando ianuccis time trumpet (ianucci does a lot of funny political satire such as the friday night armistice, time trumpet and so on, all worth checking)

Oh also maybe worth checking are The Mark Steel Lectures, he's a comedian and historian who did 3 series of lectures on historical people but with a comedy element to them all aswell, i used to like them, and you seem to like a lot of similar stuff to me

Simon Amstell took over as presenter of buzzcocks from mark lamarr 2 or 3 series ago, and also performs live (i have seen him, was funny), i also have a mark lamarr show on cd somewhere.

If you want something a bit different you could always try Omid Djalali (iraqi comedian who is now a brit citizen) but be warned he tends to shout and belly dance a lot on stage

Phil Kay rings a bell but i can't think why, was he the guy who played Dennis Pennis?

I don't know if i recommended him before but check out Peter Kay and also Time Vine (also appears in not going out) he is the guiness world record holder for most jokes told in an hour with the record standing around the 800 mark i think

Miles Jupp appeared with Frankie Boyle a lot on radio shows

As for the rest, some seem familiar like Mark watson and Jason manford, but the rest i can't really think who they are, though would probably recognise their faces from panel shows.

Paul Mertons done a bit of stuff, he redid the old Galton and simpson shows a while back like the radio ham and so on, which reminds me

Tony Hancock was a funny 60s comedian, if you want some older stuff you could always check out

Morecombe and wise
The 2 ronnies
Hancocks Half Hour
Six of the best
Steptoe and son and so on
The Likely Lads
Whatever Happened to the likely lads
The Navy Lark (starred 3rd doctor who Jon Pertwee)

I have on vhs from back in the day a best of the 60s 70s and 80s comedy set (3 tapes) they have some pretty funny stuff thats still not been released on dvd

Whatever you do though don't watch alan carr - tooth fairy coz it's total shit

[MyK]

Thanks so much, that's gonna be really helpful once I'm gonna start compiling a list of downloads I totally agree on Alan Carr. I don't even think he knows what funny means (some ppl do actually have problems understanding comedy cuz they simply don't have a sense of humour so they laugh at anything that's meant to be funny or just out of the ordinary... he's one of such performers IMO). I've seen him in "This Morning" once completely by a mistake (thought there could be something on a telly worth watching early mornings LOL) and on "TV Heaven, Telly Hell"... And he's constantly repeating his lines it's like watching all the eps of "The Fast Show" in one go... and yes, he's a fairy Regarding the older stuff... I do like that as well in sitcoms but I don't think that I'll add them to the list cuz stand up comedy is more prone to being outdated soon IMO. Think of all the political or social gags that simply don't have that pun they once had cuz there's no real world reference to them any more or while the line is funny everyone has heard it before. I think I'll stick with the younger generation that I can relate to Tho those "The Mark Steel Lectures" sounds very interesting and I might add that to the list anyway.

EDIT: I've IMDBed for "The Mark Steel Lectures" and remembered I've seen some eps on beebs... that's definitely something that I'd like to watch again

[maxpayne2409]

yeah i know what you mean about people who don't know whats funny, that's why lots of shows have a laugh track, so people at home who are too thick to know what a joke is can laugh along at the appropriate time, and on laugh tracks theres always one guy/girl who bellows louder then the others at the smallest thing

[MyK]

Perhaps it would be an interesting discussion what is funny and why we laugh in the first place but I'm afraid my English vocabulary isn't good enough and I'm incapable of expressing my thoughts on this one less some rather daft sounding sentences like "All laughter is in essence cathartic and thus pathetic and, depending on what you laugh at, defining how deeply pathetic you really are." Perhaps Dinky can shed some light on this one and I'll comment once you come up with all the necessary words and phrases?

[maxpayne2409]

dinky can't take part in this as he's american, i think it's all about personal tastes.

Some people laugh at what they are told too, some people prefer intellectual humour, others prefer violent slapstick, others prefer rude/rascist jokes and so on

[MyK]

Yeah, but Dinky could copy/paste some generally agreed on definition they teach in American schools that we could tear apart later

I agree tho it's linked to personal preference, at least with most ppl. OK, 10% at most, but I don't normally count the other 90% as being human at all - they laugh at what they're told is funny so they barely count.

Speaking for myself, I actually like most of those you mentioned but am quite selective at what I'll really watch/laugh at. My fav is intellectual humour and that's why I find Brit humour to be one of the best out there, you simply have loads of it. Then again, you also have loads of other types of humour like slapstick, droll, political satire,... whatnot that I can't even think of cuz you have so many types my native language even doesn't have words for all What I like best in Brit humour is there's so much variety to choose from and is normally way more wittier that your average American or French humour that's all bloated but as flat as a pancake. It's also a nice way to expand my knowledge of English language and culture and I couldn't care less for the two American or French equivalents

[maxpayne2409]

yeah i can't for example imagine Bottom or the young ones working in america

[MyK]

I read somewhere recently there are shit loads of quality UK comedy shows and panels waiting to be remade for US market. Now I could understand if that generally meant rewriting them in such a way they would only strip them of references to local events and in US less commonly known Brits and replacing that with US equivalents, but after I saw what they did to The Office and Coupling for example, I'm afraid that only means exporting UK talents where they can gather more bucks and not where they'd shine quality-wise

[maxpayne2409]

oh dear god i remember the US version of coupling, it was dreadful on a gigantic scale, i never saw the US version of the office

[Jynks]

us office isn't that bad... not as good as the brits but still funny.. after a while it finds its own way and becomes a very different show. If you want to see a bad one check the us version of red dwalf

[dinky]

Yeah, but Dinky could copy/paste some generally agreed on definition they teach in American schools that we could tear apart later

if you insist...

according to aristotle, we laugh at lesser/baser (than ourselves) but ultimately harmless (not evil/wicked) characters because they are ridiculous, which is related to but not the same thing as shameful. they may, however, act shamefully.

he contrasts that with tragedy, which takes as its subject "serious"/"elevated" action by character who are "like ourselves" or greater, but never perfect and never lesser than ourselves. and never evil/wicked either. thus, the proper emotions to tragedy are fear and pity (as opposed to shame for comedy).


I generally agree with that assessment. I certainly agree with it as far as american comedies go.

I also dislike the laugh track, but there are still quite a few good american sitcoms. my short list includes

andy richter controls the universe (no laugh track)
newsradio
seinfeld
friends

I might also add mash and cheers, but those are a bit before my time. haven't seen earl. scrubs is good from what I've seen but not in the above class.

everything involves personal taste, but that taste is largely culturally cultivated, so "because I'm american" is actually a damn good reason to exclude me.

glad I could not help. don't ask me any time.

[maxpayne2409]

i fucking hate seinfeld and mash just isnt funny, it tries to be funny and serious and fails on both and jsut is shit

[MyK]

Seinfeld is a complete and utter moron and isn't even close to being funny. He just rides on a wave of ignorance and self-indulgence that's surrounding him and thinks peanuts on planes are funny thing. I wish he could deal with the fact he's a sad little git (and not even good at that) in a less public way. The only character in Seinfeld that's remotely funny is Kramer and that has absolutely nothing to do with Seinfeld except that he's in his show. Seinfeld's stand up comedy really is for ppl that don't have a healthy sense of humour IMO and laugh at how small someone's pinky is. That's really really sad cuz he himself barely shows a wrinkle in his crotch.