AvP2

[dinky]

erm...the article seems to have rotated out of the news module and I can't be arsed to dig it up, so here's hoping this isn't a repeat:

it's official about the second movie:

Per the Hollywood Reporter, special-effects pros Colin and Greg Strause (X-Men: The Last Stand) will make their feature directing debut with a sequel to 2004's Alien vs. Predator.

[spudthedestroyer]

if its set on earth i'm against it, alien films should never be on earth... period.

[dinky]

agreed. but it doesn't matter, cuz not already have the been put on earth in this series (AvP & and again in A4), but they're also on earth in 2004 in the AvP movies.

sorry. that's like rubbing in the salt, isn't it? hmph. anyway, I guess these strause brothers are big on image.

[spudthedestroyer]

thats why they are wank, you put alien film on earth and its not alien.

That's what i think those director's fundamentally couldn't understand and why they should never have had the franchises. And writer's, obviously. Look at the isolation and social structure of alien, and the tired and fustrated feeling of the colonists and the marines. It works because the characters live's all suck, they are in the deep reaches of space, they are all alone, and something has come to f*ck them over.

Now of course, for predator that doesn't matter because its really cheesy, but alien doesn't work if its cheesy, its meant to be a horror franchise, even aliens is meant to scare people.

My criticism with avp, the comics too is its too cheesy, dumb and silly. The aliens never sit right. I remember reading one of the books when i was little. That was very cheesy too, but it wasn't set on earth.

Alien works best when its in deep space, and there's the no backup, no support, no escape thing going on. Its 'scarier'. Predator works as a behind the scenes stalker, who only appears at the last moments on a one on one, hunter vs prey scenario. Humans just need to get in the way and die, except for arnie, who will survive.

Since they already fucked up both franchises history and spat on the originals, i think the only way this concept will work is by giving the middle finger to the comic book. Ignoring the fact that arnie was in predator.

Make Arnie a colonial marine, send them in somewhere, have them all die in a cross fire, then have him go kill stuff. That would be the only way i think this would ever work.

Alien on its own still would work, and i'm hoping someone will put it back on track and make Alien 4 (ie an actual Alien film, no cheesy scifi), with ripley dead since i think it sound like she's asking for too much and getting too much.

Oh, and ffs, bring back Giger. That white turd was a disgrace.

edit: alien 3 too, forgot for a second then. Same thing, no earth = good plot device for the attitudes of the characters, etc.

[dinky]

I thought predator</i> was a good balance of horrorish sci-fi. cheesey is wrong. it's 80s, so there's a cheese factor. but that's 80s cheese (with apollo creed and jesse the body). predator 2</i> was ok. but you see too much of the pred. and of course that whole regae mob boss was ridiculously cheesy and dumb. but iunno, if that series is "cheesy" then I'm afraid just about every sci-fi ever is going to have to go that route.

the way the two movies blend is that predators hunt aliens and seed planets with them to hunt. there's no getting around that. the problem is that takes more than some tool of a director to convey on screen what the preds are thinking/saying without translating it or reducing it to some ridiculous pyramid scheme. and hell yes, it needs to occur in an isolated space station or po dunk colony. (you'll notice they tried to do all of that on 21st century earth - dumb that it's on earth but it doesn't eliminate an isolated/claustrophobic atmosphere...it's just uncool )

I remember in the atari jaguar game that the preds were attracted to the "heat" of the space station or something stupid like that where the marines were getting done up by aliens. it seems like a much more flimsy reason for preds to be there for me.

[spudthedestroyer]

i love both predator 1 and 2 for very different reasons. Predator is like the pride and joy of what's usually a cheesy subgenre, just like Die Hard is the pride and joy of the corny hollywood action movie genre. Both great films. They both just roll of the fact that they are essentially an example of a good movie in a bad subgenre. Die hard gets a mention because its of course another example by the same director of where he achieved something previously unattainable in the particular cliched movie genres.

I like predator 2 too, i own both on dvd, and that's the real source of the cheey comment, i mean which ever way you look at it it won't matter... This can be summed up most aptly by the fact Danny Glover has both a scope and a laser sight on his pistol, not something you really attach either to It's just a way of making his gun look cool, but in fact makes it incredibly well, you know, cheesy. Rewatch Predator 2 and you'll see what I mean. I guess its harder for sequels to try not to be just hit every cheesey spot the original carefully avoids.

And as for the arnie thing, i just remembered, doesn't matter if they bring him back, since Hicks is in Predator 2 they should be free to just ignore the fact he played someone else. Its fair game to bring him back as someone else.

I remember in the atari jaguar game that the preds were attracted to the "heat" of the space station or something stupid like that where the marines were getting done up by aliens. it seems like a much more flimsy reason for preds to be there for me.

Predators are attracted to "the heat of battle", and "have cropped up in every major warzone", wasn't that a line from predator 1 or 2? The second i think. They are drawn to warzones and fire, since they get the best kills/trophies. They start with the jungle shot in predator 2 to show that "hell look, its another fucked up warzone", or at least i think that was one of the purposes for that link shot as well as bluffing the audience.

The problem here, with your space station, heat doesn't travel through space and its got to be some big space station to observe the heat/have an atmosphere, but i'm sure they were plausably scanning the ship, and its not just heat, its heat caused by fire and weapons. Its only an atari game (its not like its half-life 2... you seen that the game has freakin audio commentary? Now that's an impressive testiment to the gaming industry being bigger than hollywood )


So what do you think to bringing back arnie as a mostly mute colonial marine?

[dinky]

yeah, the heat comment was by gary busey in the sequel. I thought the sequel was ok. but yeah, definitely cheesey (with or without the scope). I'm also pretty sure the preds show up on the space that's already infested with aliens, presumably cuz of the war zone explanation (btw - if heat doesn't travel through space then wouldn't the WHOLE explanation fail since warzone on space station or war zone on distant planet still require the same sort of detection?) iunno. I'm not defending the explanation, but I think if it's the official one for the action in LA, it should also work for the action on the space station, shouldn't it?

bah. moot point. I guess it's preferable to discussing AvP2 though, eh?

ps - who is hicks? not dutch (arnie's character) is it? cuz he was mentioned, but I'm pretty sure he's not actually in the sequel (character not actor).

[spudthedestroyer]

oh wait, i meant hudson; Bill Paxton. I keep getting them mixed up, hicks and hudson. Come to think of it, doesn't a character do that in aliens?

poor bill, what with the paxton / pullman joke in the simpsons too

[dinky]

trailer is online: http://www.aintitcool.com/node/33783

it actually looks watchable. good was kind of out the door after AVP. but the trailer alone kicks the living shit out of AVP.

[Jynks]

A lot of the aliens comics were set on earth... in a way and if it is done in the way teh comics did it would be fine... ut it would be a Alien not a preditor movie....

Basically the earth was infested and the comic series starts with the human race living on orbiting space stations... the earth is over run by the aliens... Some humans still live on the "alien planet" and there is this cool worship of the aliens as gods goign on and all sort of cool stuff.... An alien move in this kind of vein would be awsome I think.

As far as AvP gose.. i do not think the movie is going to be all great... apart from the legend of James Cameron.. there is a really really really bad history of what happens when you let special effects guys direct for the first time. I would be very surprised if the film is any good.. or it would have attracted a proper director.

The entire AvP consept is flawed if set on earth imo... they should just do it like the original comics (before they went to shit) have a sapce colony.. like in aliens... a planet were the preditors seed aliens for the hunt.... Preditors vs Aliens... humans are like us in a godzilla movie.. just in the way of te monsters.

[dinky]

yeah. one problem I doubt any AVP movie will ever get right is the balance between human perspective and actual alien/predator "perspective."

I thought mcteigue, the guy who directed v for vendetta was an fx guy, wasn't he?

edit: hmm. seems to be assistant director on a lot of sci-fi/fx movies.

[dinky]

HQ trailer: http://media.movies.ign.com/media/746/7 ... ids_1.html

[spudthedestroyer]

edit: hmm. seems to be assistant director on a lot of sci-fi/fx movies.

will mean he directed the fx shots i bet

[spudthedestroyer]

looks better than the first, but knowing how fucking awful the first was i currently don't give a shit about this movie until some reviews come in.

cgi blood

[dinky]

I'm afraid 300 is the measure of all things in this era of movie making. which means get used to the cgi, even where it is utterly and completely the wrong way to go about capturing the action. granted, 300 was supposed to be stylized, and AVP2 is not. I thought the cgi blood and heads and such (in lieu of real props) killed that movie more than anything else, but I guess that was its selling point to the studios. ok. I've digressed. my bad.

[Gem]n[]

A lot of the aliens comics were set on earth... in a way and if it is done in the way teh comics did it would be fine... ut it would be a Alien not a preditor movie....

I was just gonna say that Jynks ... I got a few 'Dark Horse' Alien comics somewhere and remember that too ... also they wrote about the original alien race (the one in Alien who's dead at the telescope/navigation thingy) coming to Earth to help rid of the Aliens ... now that would've been better ... Alien vs Alien ...

I do agree with Spud but I can't help liking this type of stuff ... it feeds my mind ... what's left of it

About AvP2:
Ok ... so is this a continuation of where the 1st left off i.e. baby alien is onboard the Predator's ship ... it fucks up their plans ... then crash lands back on Earth? ... if so then why are the Predators worring about targeting the humans as that was resolved in the 1st movie ... or is it ears later? ... shouldn't matter then either IMHO ...